Talk:Bass guitar

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cruft removal project[edit]

There's a whole lot of stuff hidden inappropriately under Footnotes and references. First, I will put these passages into the body proper. Eventually, I will return and remove any that haven't been linked to a credible source — at present, that would be all of them.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 19:11, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Footnotes substantially cleared.
The Chucking subsection is quite poor, apparently relying entirely on the memoir of the guitarist (and referencing an excerpt rather than the book itself) and on a fan website that is nothing but a bunch of links to videos of people using (or attempting to use) the technique. Without proper sourcing, this is well past WP:NOHOWTO.
The entire (poorly titled) Uses section is packed with unsourced examples, dragging the entire article into example farm territory. (I'll begin with a better title.)
Weeb Dingle (talk) 16:23, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
I have improved one reference in the "chucking" section, giving a citation to a published book with page number.Design (talk) 22:07, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
Still a long ways to go. Of the three citations midway through the first sentence — which strongly implies that Edwards created the technique AND that Edwards coined the term — one is a dead link, one mentions chucking only once in passing, one mentions chucking as a GUITAR technique:
Rodgers immersed himself in the art of funk rhythm guitar, which he learned from Edwards, who called it "chucking."
Nowhere is the origin either of the technique or the term credited to anyone, least of all Edwards.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 21:37, 3 March 2019 (UTC)
I agree that more detailed citations would be good. However, of the 6 current citations, none are deadlinks for me. Some of them are citations of Edwards calling the technique 'chucking'. I don't think it implies he invented it, it justs cites that is what HE called it. We don't NEED an origin story for the technique, for it to be included in this article. If you think the one citation about Edwards calling the guitar technique 'chucking' is not relevant, then feel free to remove it.Design (talk) 23:34, 10 March 2019 (UTC)

Acoustic bass guitar?[edit]

This article is titled "Bass guitar" but covers only the electric bass guitar. Its introduction and content should also include the acoustic bass guitar. Additionally, this article has been around since 2001 and has not progressed above START class. The Archives show much talking but very little doing. Somebody needs to take it under their wing and give it some care.

Mizsabot now established for auto-archiving. A technical request regarding no edit function provided to the right of the topic headings has been lodged here. William Harris • (talk) • 00:28, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

That's at least two disparate thoughts. First, the "acoustic bass guitar" is a bass neck stuck onto something that looks like an oversize acoustic guitar; aside from the awkwardness, the body is not large enough to properly resonate the bass tones so almost all instruments require amplification, making it directly analogous to the hollow-body electric guitar. Second, I've been pulling weeds by the handful, so "very little doing" is questionable at best. And, naturally, you are empowered to edit the article.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 21:53, 3 March 2019 (UTC)
Did you just write that an acoustic bass guitar cannot hit the "bass notes" whereas an electric guitar can? Both types of bass guitar require amplification to be heard well. Aside from that issue, where does that leave the acoustic bass guitar - do we simply make believe that it does not exist in a Wikipedia article titled "Bass guitar"? Does it not warrant some mention in the lede? WiDlliam Harris • (talk) • 07:13, 5 March 2019 (UTC)
Please stow the "incredulity." Yes, as you can likely grasp, I did indeed write that, and not for the first time (that being a guitar discussion site back around 2009). I've been playing and repairing guitars for 45 years. If I were to take an acoustic guitar and mount a pickup on it (as companies from Electro through Martin have done), I'd have a dual-purpose instrument. However, "the acoustic bass guitar" has almost no history, AND (requiring amplification) is no more "an acoustic instrument" than (say) a Tele Thinline or ES-335, which last I checked are regarded as "electric guitars."
One of the very few credible attempts was Ernie Ball's Earthwood bass… which was prone to top collapse due to the pressure of the four strings on a top design that essentially just scaled up an acoustic guitar. (FFI) Here's a photo.
Here's some thumbnail physics. If a resonant surface needs to be at least Y square inches in order to support frequency M, then it's an easy guess a similar surface intended to support frequency M/2 ought to be 2Y square inches. This analogy can readily be extended to hollow space.
Anyone who's ever seen an Earthwood realizes what a big chunk these things are. In order to have any chance to both support the stresses AND resonate at half the frequency of an acoustic guitar, an actual "acoustic bass guitar" really needs to be MUCH larger than most such instruments on the market, which suggests it's a marketing gimmick rather than something created by any luthier.
At the moment, you are attempting to push a personal opinion. As soon as you can provide at least one credible source stating that "the acoustic bass guitar" is somehow "a thing," then you'll be one step closer to making a case. But I can make the countercase that "the acoustic bass guitar" is MUCH more appropriate buried in the article about the Mexican guitarron — which, incidentally, inspired the Earthwood. Have a look at how huge the top and the body cavity are, as compared to a regular guitar.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 17:55, 9 March 2019 (UTC)
I overlooked another critical bit of practical physics: lower frequencies attenuate much more rapidly with distance. In order to have any chance of being "an acoustic instrument," a hollow-bodied bass would need to be massive in order to be heard as part of an ensemble at the depth of even a small audience (call that 20-40 feet). That's why the guitarron body is so huge. And, again, if it can't be used as an acoustic instrument, then "acoustic bass guitar" is a pointless oxymoron.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 18:24, 10 March 2019 (UTC)
OK, I bow to your greater knowledge of these things and let the matter rest. William Harris • (talk) • 20:42, 14 March 2019 (UTC)

origin[edit]

Before Tutmark's electrified solid-body bass, there was the acoustic mandocello, which dates back to at least the early 1900s Gibson. Depending on the manufacturer, scale length ranged up to 27 inches, as compared to the 30.5" Model 736, both near the modern "short scale" length. As well, there were analogous larger versions of the balalaika. Arguably, the innovations of the Audiovox bass were the slab body and the pickup, rather than the length or the guitar-like playing style.
Weeb Dingle (talk) 22:08, 3 March 2019 (UTC)

Split into separate instrument and technique articles[edit]

This article has become too long to read comfortably and maintain. Propose to split it into two articles:

  • Bass guitar – focus on the instrument itself (history, design, types, pickups, etc.)
  • Bass guitar techniques – focus on the playing aspects (picking, fretting, soloing, training, etc.)

This would effectively split the article at the current "Performance techniques" section, with sections 1–4 remaining in the "Bass guitar" article and sections 5–7 forming a new "Bass guitar techniques" article. Hopefully, this will make it easier for readers to focus on sections and add reliable sources to a vastly unreferenced topic. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:24, 19 September 2019 (UTC)

  • Oppose. Almost nothing in the article is appropriately sourced, and consists of reams of original research. Instead of splitting all this into two articles, it really ought to be properly rewritten and sourced, which would likely result in cutting lots of bloat. Popcornduff (talk) 22:31, 30 September 2019 (UTC)

Ceramic magnets vs. ceramic and steel magnets[edit]

In the section "Pickups and amplification" part "Magnetic pickups," it says "Dual coil pickups come in two main varieties; ceramic or ceramic and steel. Ceramic-only magnets have a relatively "harsher" sound than their ceramic and steel counterparts, and are thus used more commonly in heavier rock styles (heavy metal music, hardcore punk, etc.)." Is this even accurate? Why isn't anything like that in other articles like "Humbucker" and "Pickup (music technology)"? Aren't the two chief magnets used in electric guitars alnico and ferrite? Maybe "ceramic" is ferrite and "steel" is alnico, IDK... WorldQuestioneer (talk) 23:23, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

@WorldQuestioneer: Many WP music instrument and related articles contain personal opinion/commentary that is not backed up by reliable sources (note the "multiple issues" box at the top of the article that have been in place for years). When you see questionable material without any inline citations, I suggest you correct it with proper references or remove it. Some article topics may already have separate articles (such as tuning, pickups, amplification, and effects) that deal with the subject in more detail. This article should only provide an overview of those areas and leave the finer points to the other articles. In your example, ceramic vs. other is excessive detail for a general article about the instrument, especially when the existing pickup article is linked.—Ojorojo (talk) 14:42, 19 January 2020 (UTC)
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