Talk:Flag of the United States

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Flag of the United States has been listed as a level-5 vital article in History. If you can improve it, please do. This article has been rated as B-Class.

This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, labor, traveled), and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

WikiProject Heraldry and vexillology

(Rated B-class)

	Heraldry portal v t e Flag of the United States is within the scope of the Heraldry and vexillology WikiProject, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of heraldry and vexillology. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks.
B	This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.

WikiProject United States

(Rated B-class, Top-importance)

	United States portal v t e This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. Template Usage Articles Requested! Become a Member Project Talk Unreferenced BLPs Alerts
B	This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.
Top	This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.

	This article has been selected for use on the United States portal.

A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on June 14, 2004, June 14, 2005, June 14, 2006, June 14, 2007, June 14, 2008, and June 14, 2017.

Flag of the United States has been selected to be featured on the United States Portal.

Requested move 11 June 2020[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Procedural close. The original nomination was changed by another user, causing disruption to the original proposal. Rreagan007 (talk) 04:11, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

Flag of the United States → American Flag
Flag of Australia → Australian Flag
Flag of Canada → Canadian Flag
Flag of the United Kingdom → British Flag
Flag of India → Indian Flag
Flag of France → French Flag
Flag of Germany → German Flag
Flag of Pakistan → Pakistani Flag
Flag of New Zealand → New Zealand Flag
Flag of Italy → Italian Flag
Flag of Spain → Spanish Flag – per WP:COMMONNAME. This flag is commonly known as the "American Flag". Very rarely will someone actually refer to it formally as the "Flag of the United States". And just as we use "Union Jack" as the article title rather than the more formal "Flag of the United Kingdom" or more accurate "Union Flag", so too should we list this article at its common name. Rreagan007 (talk) 21:47, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

Comments - @Rreagan007:, are you the IP user who added all the other flags to this discussion? If so, fine. But if not ,this is unhelpful for another user to do. It makes this whole discussion more confusing, and increases the likelihood of a no consensus. For the most part, almost all flag articles follow a "Flag of x" format, and this is probably for the best. (I don't know if there's an official naming convention guideline or not.) The Union Jack is a notable exception, and shouldn't be used as a pattern for all flags. Otherwise The US flag would be at "The Stars and Stripes". - [[User:BilCat|] (talk) 23:19, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

@BilCat: No, that wasn't me. The only one that I proposed moving was the American Flag. Rreagan007 (talk) 03:57, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks. I didn't think it was you, but I didn't want to assume either way. I'm not sure if it's a newbie mistake, incompetence, or gaming the system. ~~I'm tempted to close out the extra additions, and let the original continue to run. I may ask an admin to look at this.~~ - BilCat (talk) 04:13, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

OPPOSE (very, very strongly). These terms already redirect here. The Union Jack is a UNIQUE EXCEPTION due to the fact that the WP:COMMONNAME isn't "Flag of X" or "X flag", but instead it's referred to by the name "Union Jack" the VAST MAJORITY of the time. (It's different than people calling the flag of India "the Indian flag".) This move would have problematic consequences and would open up a gigantic can-of-worms (...where would it stop? what about territories and states? what about places with less-common demonyms, or controversial ones?). If we move this, we'll be inundated with unhelpful move requests that will only make flag pages harder to find. Paintspot Infez (talk) 23:22, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

Strong Oppose ALL - No proof has been submitted to show that any of these alternatives are the most common name for each flag. - BilCat (talk) 23:24, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

Oppose This doesn't seem to be necessary to me and breaks the format that WP has used on flag names with no issues for a long time. If such a change is made, I would prefer the more specific United States flag to keep the same title as the main article United States. American, broadly speaking can mean the people of the U.S. or of the American continent(s), so United States would be the most specific (and least contentious) in this case. Garuda28 (talk) 23:26, 11 June 2020 (UTC)
- American Flag already redirects here, as this article is the primary topic for that title,.and rightly so. I.was leaning towards support until the discussion scope was suddenly expanded. - BilCat (talk) 23:43, 11 June 2020 (UTC)
  - No disagreement on that BilCat. I've just seen something like that (which you and I both appear to agree shouldn't be contentious) become contentious because of different readings of the word. Regardless, I don't think it will be necessary based on how this is going. Garuda28 (talk) 23:45, 11 June 2020 (UTC)
Support because in normal Australian english it is referred to as the Australian flag or more formally in Australian legislation as the Australian National Flag https://www.legislation.gov.au/Details/C2008C00376 not the Flag of Australia. Being consistent on Wikipedia isnt a valid reason to denigrate the Australian National Flag by referring to by a name that is neither Official or informally accepted usages. Gnan garra 00:33, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

Strong Oppose ALL This is Ridiculous and all Country flag pages should match with eachother --BlinxTheKitty (talk) 01:09, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Aspect ratios[edit]

The 50-star flag is 19:10. From Flag of Israel: "The flag was ten feet by six feet--in the same proportions as the flag of the United States--and became known as the Flag of Zion. It was accepted as the official Zionist flag at the Second Zionist Congress held in Switzerland in 1898". Was the US flag then 1 2/3:1? For those <=48-star versions for which there was an official aspect ratio, could that ratio be listed? Thank you. JDAWiseman (talk) 10:01, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Until well into the 19th century, there was no detailed flag specification except internal U.S. Navy documents regulating flags to be purchased by the Navy (the first such document in 1818)... AnonMoos (talk) 04:48, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

The Fly of the Canton should be listed as D = .40 (2/5 of B). VenningG (talk) 11:58, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion[edit]

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

US Marine Corps War Memorial (Iwo Jima Monument) near Washington DC.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 00:30, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

Discussion closed with keep. --Foghe (talk) 21:17, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 01 November 2020[edit]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

I wrote here a year ago requesting a change to the table in the "Historical progression of designs" subsection, but I see now that no one acted on my request (either to make the proposed change or to decline my request). So here I am again. The 1795-1818 flag is the only one to have a number of stripes other than 13, so it strikes me as needlessly taking up space to have a "Number of stripes" column in the table. It would make more sense to remove the column and instead add something to the "States represented by new stars" column saying that 1795-1818 was the only flag to have 15 stripes.

My request: Remove the "Number of stripes" column in the table under "Historical progression of designs", and add some text to the 1795-1818 flag explaining this was the only version to have 15 stripes. This is how I want the table to look:

Extended content

Number of stars	States represented by new stars	Dates in use	Duration
0	Union Jack instead of stars, red and white stripes represent Connecticut, Delaware, Georgia, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Virginia	December 3, 1775^[1] – June 14, 1777	1 ¹⁄₂ years
13	Connecticut, Delaware, Georgia, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Virginia	June 14, 1777 – May 1, 1795	18 years
15	Vermont, Kentucky. This version of the flag was the only one to use 15 stars, rather than the usual 13.	May 1, 1795 – July 3, 1818	23 years
20	Indiana, Louisiana, Mississippi, Ohio, Tennessee	July 4, 1818 – July 3, 1819	1 year
21	Illinois	July 4, 1819 – July 3, 1820	1 year
23	Alabama, Maine	July 4, 1820 – July 3, 1822	2 years
24	Missouri	July 4, 1822 – July 3, 1836 1831 term "Old Glory" coined	14 years
25	Arkansas	July 4, 1836 – July 3, 1837	1 year
26	Michigan	July 4, 1837 – July 3, 1845	8 years
27	Florida	July 4, 1845 – July 3, 1846	1 year
28	Texas	July 4, 1846 – July 3, 1847	1 year
29	Iowa	July 4, 1847 – July 3, 1848	1 year
30	Wisconsin	July 4, 1848 – July 3, 1851	3 years
31	California	July 4, 1851 – July 3, 1858	7 years
32	Minnesota	July 4, 1858 – July 3, 1859	1 year
33	Oregon	July 4, 1859 – July 3, 1861	2 years
34	Kansas	July 4, 1861 – July 3, 1863	2 years
35	West Virginia	July 4, 1863 – July 3, 1865	2 years
36	Nevada	July 4, 1865 – July 3, 1867	2 years
37	Nebraska	July 4, 1867 – July 3, 1877	10 years
38	Colorado	July 4, 1877 – July 3, 1890	13 years
43	Idaho, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Washington	July 4, 1890 – July 3, 1891	1 year
44	Wyoming	July 4, 1891 – July 3, 1896	5 years
45	Utah	July 4, 1896 – July 3, 1908	12 years
46	Oklahoma	July 4, 1908 – July 3, 1912	4 years
48	Arizona, New Mexico	July 4, 1912 – July 3, 1959	47 years
49	Alaska	July 4, 1959 – July 3, 1960	1 year
50	Hawaii	July 4, 1960 – present	60 years

Thank you in advance. - 188.182.13.127 (talk) 00:12, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

References

^ Leepson, Marc. (2005). Flag: An American Biography. New York: St. Martin's Press.

Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. BilCat (talk) 01:58, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

"🇺🇸" listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]

A discussion is taking place to address the redirect 🇺🇸. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 December 7#🇺🇸 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Aasim (talk) 05:14, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

[leepson-1] Leepson, Marc. (2005). Flag: An American Biography. New York: St. Martin's Press.

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